Оценка на условията на JoiaBet

It's a new casino, but it starts with some things that are worthless for players. Casinos that work fairly specify how their bonus works, without hiding or complicating information, so that it is clear and easy to understand. This JoiaBet doesn't do that, with obscure terms that make the player feel cheated when playing.

The Casino Guru review is important as it will make it clear to other players about the casino's terms, which in my opinion are unfair, deceptive and have a selfish purpose.

És um cassino novo, porém já começa com algumas coisas sem valor para os joadores. Cassinos que trabalham de forma justa, especificam como seu bônus funciona, sem ocultar ou dificultar informações, para que sejam claras e de fácil entendimento. Este JoiaBet não faz isso, com termos obscuros que faz com que o jogador se sinta enganado ao jogar.

A avaliação do Casino Guru é importante, pois ficará claro a outros jogadores sobre os termos do casino, que ao meu ver são injustos, enganosos e com finalidade egoísta.

Hi, the casino is already on our list so I'm sure we're going to add the review during future weeks. I'm wondering, is there any particular part of the terms and conditions that sounds suspicious to you? Could you be more specific? Maybe I could ask my colleagues to focus on it in the review...

Yes Daniel, they need to specify how the bonus works, since it can only be wagered with real money.

Other casinos have this in their terms very clearly, which Joiabet doesn't do... It was only after reading and re-reading that I realized this.

In this case, they take advantage of this lack of information, and this is not being done well.

Sim Daniel, eles precisam especificar como funciona o bônus, uma vez que ele só pode ser apostado com dinheiro real.

Os outros cassinos tem isso nos termos bem claro, o que o Joiabet não faz... Só depois de ler e reler foi que constatei isso.

Nesse caso, eles tiram vantagem dessa falta de informação, e isso não está sendo bem feito.

Thanks for the insight and I'll have our team take a look at it. 

Anyway, when you say that: "they take advantage of this lack of information" have you had any unpleasant experiences with the use of the bonus ?

Yes, I managed to accumulate R$3,000 with the bonus, and I realized that all earnings made with real money go to the bonus money. Real money wins must be paid out in real money, not bonuses. Over time, all your wins are worthless, because only real money counts to bet and meet the requirements. The bonus money becomes like a bait, a decoy.

Sim, consegui acumular R$ 3.000 com o bônus, e percebi que todo ganho obtido com o dinheiro real vai para o dinheiro de bônus. As vitórias em dinheiro real devem ser pagas em dinheiro real, e não em bônus. Com o tempo todas as suas vitórias não valem nada, pois para apostar e cumprir os requisitos, só dinheiro real conta. O dinheiro de bônus fica como uma isca, um engodo.

Sure, I get what you're saying. I suppose that after such an experience you probably won't play in this casino with bonus anymore right ? 

However, It's good that you at least pointed out how the bonuses work in this casino and other players will have a chance to see it. If you come across anything else suspicious, feel free to update us.  

Nevertheless, is this casino still interesting for you if we don't look at the bonuses ? 🙂

It's not interesting...

Não é interessante...

I got it. I was asking because you only talked about the bonus, so they should have clearer Terms and Conditions for them. You didn't mention other things, so I was curious if you would still feel like playing at this casino. 

However, as I see, you seem to be discouraged to play here completely, which of course I don't take badly, because it's everyone's personal preference. 

If I may ask, do you like any other casinos ? 

Yes, I play at other casinos like Sol, Brazzino777, Gamble City, SunPlay, Izzi... Anyway, I play a lot, and I see when casinos have fair and clear terms... I've been having fun at online casinos for about two years, and I think I had some experience in the operating modes, but I know there is a lot to understand, especially when it comes to the rules of each casino.

As I said, some are interesting and fair, but casinos that hide their terms, or offer bonuses that I can't take advantage of, are discarded from my list...

I also enjoy the no deposit bonuses you offer, so I know which casino is the most interesting to deposit my money at.

Sim, jogo em outros cassinos como Sol, Brazzino777, Gamble City, SunPlay, Izzi... Enfim, jogo bastante, e vejo quando cassinos tem termos justos e claros... Tenho uns dois anos que me divirto em cassinos online, e acho que tive uma certa experiência nos modos operantes, mas sei que há muito a prender, principalmente na questão das regras de cada cassino.

Como eu disse, alguns são interessantes e justos, mas cassinos que ocultam seus termos, ou oferecem bônus da qual eu não possa usufruir, são descartados de minha lista...

Também desfruto dos bônus sem depósitos que vocês oferecem, já para saber qual cassino é mais interessante para depositar meu dinheiro.

Well, I certainly agree with you about the need to understand a lot about online casinos. I understand that most players probably don't read the Terms and Conditions very much, but at least some basic information would be useful. 

As far as bonuses are concerned, I'm glad we are helpful in this regard. Which casino is the top for you in terms of bonuses ? 

Additionally, as far as casinos hiding their terms is concerned, we have a clear position on that: We do not tolerate any hidden or predatory rules because they are unfair towards players and put them at a disadvantage. If we notice them during our review process or if they are brought to our attention through a player complaint, we decrease the reputation rating and also try to get the casino to start behaving fairly if it's within our capabilities.

Our recommendation in this case is that every single rule that players are required to follow should be stated in the casino's general T&Cs or in the Bonus T&Cs of each bonus. The casino should never try to apply rules that are not stated publicly, as players have no way of knowing about them.

Certainly, if you would like to know more about this topic or others, just click here: Fair Gambling Codex, where several things are explained with our view on them.  

I have one more question and that is, which casino do you have on your blacklist because of the hidden rules?

Not only due to the hidden terms, but the operation of the casino itself with prize pools and other factors.

1xbet, Mostbet, Vulkanbet, Joiabet, Snatch and all those that you mark on the site as unfair terms. The problem is not only losing money through deception, but also becoming frustrated. Things like this break up your fun, and that's not cool. Not to mention that some casinos are much more difficult to win than others, and luck and randomness cannot explain it.

Do casinos have any tool that controls RTP of games? As far as I know, these RTPs can only be changed by the provider, who owns the games. But in some, it is clear that the return, as well as the victories, are much smaller and scarcer, respectively.

There is a network of casinos, for example, such as Galaxy, Mr Fortune, bcasino and Boo, which offer very high bonuses offered to players, but impose limits on the amount of bets and allowed play with bonuses. So far so good, as usual. But if I accidentally bet wrong, because when several games are started, they appear with bets above the stipulated value, and if I make a spin, even if accidental, I lose the right to the bonus. And you only discover this after you meet the requirements and try to withdraw the money. They throw terms at the players, and bring anger.

These types of casinos are on my black list, although I still take a chance on Mr. Fortune. So, I appreciate your work precisely for that reason, many cases are identified and indicated here, so that we can enjoy fun without being deceived.

Não só devido aos termos ocultos, mas a operação do cassino em si com premiações e outros fatores.

1xbet, Mostbet, Vulkanbet, Joiabet, Snatch e todos aqueles que vocês marcam no site como termos injustos. O problema não é só perder o dinheiro por enganação, mas também ficar frustrado. Coisas assim quebram sua diversão, e isso não é legal. Sem contar que alguns cassinos é bem mais difícil de ganhar do que outros, e a sorte e aleatoriedade não conseguem explicar.

Os cassinos possuem alguma ferramenta que controla RTP dos jogos? Até onde sei, esses RTPs só podem ser alterados pelo provedor, proprietário dos jogos. Mas em alguns, percebe-se que o retorno, bem como as vitórias, são bem menores e mais escassas, respectivamente.

Existe uma rede de cassinos por exemplo, a qual o Galaxy, Mr Fortune, bcasino e Boo, que exploram bônus altíssimos oferecidos ao jogador, mas impõe limites como valor de aposta e jogo permitido com bônus. Até aí tudo certo, é de costume. Mas se eu acidentalmente apostar errado, pois vários jogos quando são iniciados, aparecem com apostas acima do valor estipulado, e se der um giro, mesmo que acidental, perde o direito do bônus. E você só descobre isso depois que cumpre os requisitos e tenta sacar o dinheiro. Ele jogam os termos contra os jogadores, e trazem raiva.

Estes tipos de cassinos estão na minha lista negra, apesar de ainda arriscar no Mr. Fortune. Então, aprecio o trabalho de vocês justamente por isso, muitos casos são aqui identificados e indicados, para que possamos desfrutar de diversão sem sermos enganados.

Cool, thanks for the link Jaro.

Bacana, obrigado pelo link Jaro.

Hi, I understood better what you wrote. Of course, if a casino has unfair Terms and Conditions, it's more of a red flag for the player I would say. 

As for the RTP, it is obviously set by the provider, but for example a game provider like Play n go gives casinos the chance to set their RTP and the casino chooses the option. On this topic of RTP, I'll add a guide that might also be useful for you: https://casino.guru/learn-about-games-of-chance-rtp-variance

Regarding the other casinos and their rules, certainly you should always read them well and decide if you want to deposit there. The blacklist of casinos is quite understandable and I think you have it on some basis.

Concerning the link I provided before, you are welcome. It sure is nice to get information that you may not have had or knew. That's what the guides are for. So if I can help at least like this I will do it gladly. 

Thank you Jaro, I had already read about RTP and Volatility, today I understand the difference and importance of the two. As for the Play'n Go information, I didn't know. Are there other providers that allow changing RTP?

At Joiabet, Play'n Go slots gave very high prizes, and I noticed that the majority of no deposit free spins are from this game provider, which allows casinos to vary winnings. Thank you very much for this idea, it is completely plausible... RTP is the return to player percentage, and volatility is the payment of huge prizes, if I understand the article correctly. The greater the volatility, the greater the prizes, but with a much lower frequency of payments. Jackpot games have a high volatility rate, as the prizes tend to be very generous. A game with very high volatility is Blood Suckers, from Netent, a stingy game to pay, you have to be good with your wallet to try for a prize there...

I would really like to know which other providers allow changing their RTPs, is this possible Jaro?

These games are very rigged, which is not good since I am playing gambling games. I want to depend only on my luck and strategy to play, and not depend on the casino's good day allowing me to win, if you know what I mean.

Obrigado Jaro, eu já havia lido sobre RTP e Volatilidade, hoje entendo a diferença e importância dos dois. Já a informação da Play'n Go eu não sabia. Existem outors fornecedores que permitem a mudança de RTP?

Nesse Joiabet, as slots Play'n Go deram prêmios altíssimos, e percebo que a maioria dos free spins sem depósito são desse fornecedor de jogo, o que permite os cassinos variarem os ganhos. Muito obrigado por esta ideia, ela é totalmente plausível... RTP é a porcentagem de retorno ao jogador, e volatilidade é o pagamento de prêmios enormes, se entendi bem o artigo. Quanto maior a volatilidade, maiores são os prêmios, porém com uma frequência bem menor de pagamentos. Jogos de jackpot tem uma taxa alta de volatilidade, pois os prêmios costumam ser bem generosos. Um jogo de altíssima volatilidade é o tal do Blood Suckers, da Netent, jogo sovina para pagar, tem de ser bom de bolso para tentar um prêmio ali...

Gostaria muito de saber quais outros fornecedores permitem a mudança dos seus RTPs, é possível Jaro?

Estes jogos são muito manipulados, o que não é nada bom, uma vez que estou jogando jogos de azar. Quero depender apenas de minha sorte e estratégia para jogar, e não ainda depender do dia bom do cassino permitindo com que eu vença, se é que me entende.

Jaro, I would like to comment on something with you: On Friday (08/09) I opened an account at SlotBox Casino, as there was an eye-catching bonus and after reading the T&C, I thought it was cool to play. I deposited €20 euros using the Pix method, offered by Skrill, where the money was debited from my bank account, but it was not credited to the casino. I contacted live chat and they said they opened a ticket and would inform me via email within 48 hours.

The next day I received the ticket back, which said that they had resolved the payment problem. I happily went to the website, and the balance was zero. I responded to the email and was told in response: what was resolved was the payment method, and I could now make a new deposit. I found this hilarious, tragic and comical at the same time, but I politely questioned what would be resolved. She said that the operator would refund the amount, but so far nothing, no response from Skrill and no concern from the Casino. What do I do best?

Jaro, gostaria de comentar uma coisa com você: Na sexta (08/09) eu abri uma conta no SlotBox Cassino, pois havia um bônus chamativo e ao ler os T&C, achei legal jogar. Depositei 20€ euros através do método Pix, oferecido pela Skrill, onde o dinheiro foi debitado da minha conta bancária, mas não creditou no cassino. Entrei em contato com o chat ao vivo e disseram que abriram um ticket, e me informariam por e-mail num prazo de 48 h.

No dia seguinte recebi o retorno do ticket, onde dizia que haviam solucionado o problema do pagamento. Contente fui ao site, e o saldo estava zero. Respondi o e-mail e me foi dito em resposta: o que estava resolvido era o método de pagamento, e eu já poderia fazer um novo depósito. Achei isso hilário, trágico e cômico ao mesmo tempo, mas questionei educadamente o que seria resolvido. Ela disse que a operadora estornaria o valor, mas até agora nada, nem resposta da Skrill e nem o Cassino preocupado. O que faço de mais adequado?

Hi, about RTP and volatility, you got it right. You wrote that : "The greater the volatility, the greater the prizes, but with a much lower frequency of payments" and that's exactly how it works, so kudos to you. 

As for the reduction in RTP for game providers, I will try to find out this information from my colleagues and let you know when I learn something new. 

Hi, I think in this case it would be a good idea to contact the payment provider if the money has not been credited to your casino account. However, I would like to point out that this may be a longer process as the casino would have their hands tied in this case.

However, If the casino has told you that they will refund your amount and nothing has happened yet and you still don't know anything new, I would recommend filing a complaint at this link: https://pt.casino.guru/reclamacoes/todas

Do you think you will wait or try to file a complaint ? Anyway, let us know if you find out more information.

I will wait for the wallet deadline, which is 5 business days. If they don't refund my money, I will file a complaint as Jaro suggested. I already sent a message to the Skrill company, and this is what I got in response. Friday is the deadline... Thanks for your attention Jaro, great to talk to you.

Eu vou aguardar o prazo da wallet, que são de 5 dias úteis. Se eles não devolverem meu dinheiro, farei a reclamação como sugeriu Jaro. Eu já enviei mensagem para a empresa Skrill, e foi o que obtive de resposta. Sexta feira é o prazo final... Obrigado pelas atenção Jaro, muito bom falar com vc.

Hello! I just want to step in to discussion about how RTP between game providers and casinos works.

Basically, how it works is that when game providers release game, he develop this game with several RTP options. Because PlayNGo was used as an example, i will continue with them - they make usually 5 different RTP versions of game (96.2, 94.2, 92.2 and so on - not real numbers, just example). When any casino wants to use this game, they can choose from those versions. Its not like they can type any number they want - every game has own math and its not possible.

And to answer your question, almost every provider use this system - its not PlayNGo special, they are just an example. So there are much more providers that can give casino options to choose from. All the popular providers you can think of use this.

Also, it's not like casino are changing this RTPs daily, as they want to. They just simply have option which RTP version they will run on site. To make sure which RTP is used in the games you play, you always have to check informations INSIDE the game. So when you play game there is usually "i", as information icon (example) where you can read all about game. It's the accurate one and you know what is the real RTP of game you play.

Hope it helps a little with understanding 🙂

Too much. You explaining it was really simple. So let's assume that the casino is experiencing low revenue, and to compensate for this revenue it decides to use the version with a lower RTP. Is this correct?

I always look for RTP and Volatility information, and only play those that have above 95%, which is a more acceptable statistic. Thank you for the information, and I will always look for you to answer questions, it is very helpful to understand where we put our money.

Demais. Você explicando ficou até simples. Então vamos supor que o cassino esteja em um dia de receita baixa, e para compensar essa receita ele decide por utilizar a versão com um RTP mais baixo. Isso está correto?

Sempre procuro as informações de RTP e de Volatilidade, e dou só jogo aqueles que possuem acima de 95%, que é uma estatística mais aceitável. Obrigado pelas informações, e sempre irei procurar vcs para sanar dúvidas, sai de muita valia para compreender onde colocamos nosso dinheiro.